steveb at creek-and-cowley.com
Thu Oct 3 16:59:51 PDT 2002
On Thu, 2002-10-03 at 21:15, Tony Karakashian wrote:
> A troll would imply that I participate in these
> forums, yet do not use the product.
I guess what he was referring to was the way you constantly advocate MS
in the wrong place. Regardless of which is better, this is a LINUX
crowd, after all. LFS_chat does cover a wide range of topics, true, but
that doesn't mean we want to hear EVERYTHING everyone has to say.
I also will guess that nobody really cares what you use at home. The
one particular thing that offends them is your choice of Outlook as
mailer, with its unfortunate consequences. In fact, having just spent
15 minutes trying to hop around and piece together this thread from all
the (apparently) dozens of fragments which begin with a message from
you, I find I'm quite annoyed as well, and also wish you would start
using a proper mail program.
> Can you say the same?
Boasting about your credentials won't get you very far here. In fact,
you might offend a few of the wrong people and make a serious fool of
yourself. This list/group's readership includes very experienced
old-timers like Bill Maltby, and very serious technical coders like Greg
Schafer. Nobody is impressed by claims of ten years' use which,
frankly, are no big deal.
In fact, if you've taken then chance to step back and look with a bit of
perspective you must have seen by now that you've ALREADY offended many
people, and not in trivial ways. Why do you continue, and how can you
claim not to be trolling when your style and pronouncements are so
> I take offense at the implication that the reason
> I don't use Linux as a primary OS is because I'm
> either some kind of mindless automaton, or simply
> stupid. I use it because it is the best fit for
> my business for what we use it for. For the
> high-end stuff, we use Unix (HP-UX).
I'll say it one more time just to make sure you get the point:
Probably nobody really cares what you use at home, unless it's the
subject of this group/list: Linux. It bugs us that you keep TELLING us
> Unlike most open sourcers I have met,
> I don't have just one hammer
You just objected to people mis-characterizing you, and now you're doing
the same thing back to an entire group of people. This will not make
> At a minimum,
> Linux will need to do exactly EVERYTHING that
> Windows can do before I can even consider it. I
> do not have the temerity to tell my entire
> organization "YOU HAVE TO USE THIS", especially
> if there's a chance that a single user will come
> to me and say, "How do I do...?" and I have to
> answer..."You can't."
This is a strategic point which is vaguely tangential to Linux and maybe
worth a bit of discussion. Your argument is overstated and has a huge
and obvious hole: Your concern should be to maintain services, not
systems. If users can keep doing the same jobs at least as well as
before, they don't care about the technology behind it. Thus, there is
no need to reproduce everything Windows CAN do.
No two operating systems have all the same capabilities so your
argument, if taken literally, would prevent anyone from ever changing
What you should be doing, if you are an IT manager, is looking at their
real needs (expressed, seen and anticipated) and coming up with the best
possible solution according to your expertise. Then you should stick to
what you said and fight the political battles to make it happen.
Details about which OS are entirely secondary but you have moved them to
the fore. This is perhaps the most common fault in both technical
consulting and management.
Unsubscribe: send email to listar at linuxfromscratch.org
and put 'unsubscribe lfs-chat' in the subject header of the message
More information about the lfs-chat